MBW’s World’s Biggest Producers collection sees us interview – and have fun – among the excellent skills working in studios throughout the a long time. Right here, we converse with British super-producer James Ford about his function as a key artistic collaborator with Arctic Monkeys, an important hyperlink in Blur’s reunion, and way more. World’s Biggest Producers is supported by Hipgnosis Tune Administration.
James Ford is well-known for producing Arctic Monkeys. However he might simply have simply turn out to be infamous for not producing Arctic Monkeys.
In 2005, Ford was simply breaking out as a producer. He’d grown up in Leek, Staffordshire as a music obsessive. His dad performed in native bands and, after flute and piano classes at college and encouragement from a music instructor that may let him bunk off rugby to play the drums, he too joined the native pub circuit.
After years of “cider, magic mushrooms and taking part in in bizarre funk bands”, he went to Manchester for college and fashioned Simian, who brought about fairly a buzz on the Noughties indie scene.
They moved to London however, in keeping with Ford, “fell into the basic factor of attempting to maintain the label pleased on our second report… We ended up cracking below the strain and splitting up.”
Simian went on to have an enormous posthumous hit with a Justice remix, We Are Your Buddies, however, on the time, the remainder of the band acquired “correct jobs”, whereas Ford and keyboard participant Jas Shaw fashioned DJ/dance music spin-off Simian Cell Disco. Ford additionally began producing “anybody and everybody who would have me”.
The names he was producing slowly acquired greater till he met Laurence Bell at Domino, who launched him to Arctic Monkeys.
He and Mike Crossey decamped with the band to Liverpool’s Motor Museum studio to work on some “fairly gnarly, punky, fairly aggy” variations of songs that may characteristic on the band’s iconic debut album, No matter Folks Say I Am, That’s What I’m Not. Ford, nonetheless, didn’t characteristic on the completed report, having been changed by Jim Abbiss.
“I used to be completely gutted,” Ford says right now, talking to MBW in his residence studio in Clapton, East London. “I might see what was about to occur to them: their star was within the ascendant and the hype round them… It was a reasonably heady time. However we acquired phrase that the Individuals didn’t just like the recordings. It was the most important alternative I’d ever had, and it didn’t go the way in which I supposed.
“However I nonetheless felt like I used to be in the proper place,” he provides. “I used to be gutted, however I wasn’t like, ‘Again to the drafting board’. I used to be simply going to have to choose myself up and keep on, I felt one thing else would come alongside.”
“IT WAS THE BIGGEST OPPORTUNITY I’D EVER HAD AND IT DIDN’T GO THE WAY I INTENDED.”
He was proper to not fear. Since then, Ford has turn out to be the UK music business’s go-to producer for… effectively, just about something, actually.
His deliberate avoidance of a ‘trademark sound’ means he can add edge to pop stars (Kylie Minogue, Jessie Ware), reinvigorate legendary bands (Blur, Depeche Mode), or give new artists the sonic armour-plating they should climate right now’s hostile atmosphere for breakthrough acts.
And, because it seems, he can produce Arctic Monkeys in any case. After a ‘no exhausting emotions’ chat at an awards ceremony quickly after the debut album got here out, he’s labored on each AM album since, forging one in all British rock’s longest-running, most efficient relationships. He even performs in Alex Turner’s spin-off band, The Final Shadow Puppets.
And past the Arctics, Ford is at the moment on the form of roll most producers can solely dream of. Within the final yr or so, he’s helmed Depeche Mode’s Memento Mori, Jessie Ware’s That! Feels Good!, Blur’s The Ballad Of Darren, Pet Store Boys’ Nonetheless and The Final Dinner Get together’s Prelude To Ecstasy, amongst others.
However, whereas his telephone is working as sizzling as that streak of smashes, he’s determined to make 2024 “a fallow yr”. He’ll be taking part in in Portishead singer Beth Gibbons’ touring band (having produced her current album, Lives Outgrown), seeking to work on the follow-up to his critically acclaimed debut solo album, 2023’s The Hum, and having fun with “a bit ‘saying no to issues’ part”.
Earlier than he can put his ft up, nonetheless, there’s the small matter of speaking MBW by way of studio bust-ups, business vegetation and why he doesn’t even take into consideration TikTok…
WHY DOES YOUR RELATIONSHIP WITH ARCTIC MONKEYS WORK SO WELL?
We share a musical language now, we’ve grown up collectively. I’ve a lot respect for them and for Alex’s writing. I simply try to assist them develop in one of the best ways potential and be sincere with them.
I don’t know why it’s lasted so lengthy – it’s like a friendship or a wedding at this level, the place it’s exhausting to see [a way] out of it! It’s greater than only a producer-artist relationship.
It in all probability could be good for them to work with different producers with a extra goal view of it. However, while you’re working with Alex after which go and work with one other band you’ve by no means labored with earlier than, you discover how a lot clarification there may be. We don’t want to speak about references or snare sounds anymore. It means you’ll be able to push on to the following part with out having to go over a great deal of previous floor.
I really like working with new artists and having that recent vitality – and there’s a respect you’ll be able to command with new artists that you would be able to’t with somebody you’ve recognized for knocking on 20 years! You don’t have that very same energy or no matter [with Arctic Monkeys], however you even have this very completely different, deep information and love for what they do this informs it another way.
YOU SEEM TO HAVE A GOOD RADAR FOR NEW BANDS THAT ARE GOING TO MAKE IT. WHY IS IT SO HARD FOR NEW ARTISTS TO BREAK THROUGH AT THE MOMENT?
I try to keep out of the enterprise dialog. I’m going on my intuition and my musical style; if I hear a demo that’s fascinating and doesn’t really feel like one thing I’ve heard earlier than, and I can think about that going over effectively, that’s about so far as my evaluation goes.
You may inform when individuals have gotten momentum behind them, even when it comes to their perspective or the individuals which might be round them, and generally that may affect it. But it surely’s actually exhausting to second guess what’s and isn’t going to work. I simply go along with what’s thrilling and what I’d need to take heed to.
Picture credit score: Cal McIntyre
HOW AWARE WERE YOU OF THE NOISE AROUND THE LAST DINNER PARTY BEFORE YOU PRODUCED THEM?
The business plant factor? After I heard their demos, there was no [record] business round it. That being mentioned, the way in which I heard about them was by way of [Tara Richardson], a supervisor who I labored with on a Foals report. She’s working with Q Prime, one of many largest heavy-hitter administration corporations on this planet.
They’re fairly a formidable bunch of individuals in order that clearly factored in my head: these songs are nice, it’s artistic, the women can play the shit out of their devices they usually can write, that is fascinating. And so they’ve acquired Q Prime behind them, that’s much more fascinating, as a result of individuals are going to listen to it.
As a result of they’re heavy-hitters, they acquired me concerned, they acquired a giant label concerned, they acquired them on a number of payments early on, in all probability earlier than they had been actually prepared… So, from an outdoor perspective, it possibly appears like this business conspiracy, however it’s not.
It’s an old style massive administration push, the identical as I noticed with a great deal of bands. However these bands had been all guys and now it’s a bunch of ladies, individuals are very fast to leap on this, ‘They will’t have accomplished all of it themselves, it should be this business plant factor’.
There’s a touch of misogyny in that. Their styling and ostentatious strategy was their thought from the start. They’d the loopy concepts for music movies on our first assembly within the espresso store not far away. It’s very a lot all from them, however individuals for some motive can’t consider that, partly as a result of they’re ladies.
DO YOU HAVE TO BECOME A DIFFERENT TYPE OF PRODUCER FOR A NEW BAND VERSUS AN ESTABLISHED ONE?
One of many issues I actually like about being a producer is it’s a very completely different course of each time. I’m fortunate that I’ve acquired a number of strings to my bow; I can play and write, do the technical stuff, I combine – I can take the method from the start to the top if wants be.
“ONE OF THE THINGS I LIKE ABOUT BEING A PRODUCER IS IT’S A TOTALLY DIFFERENT PROCESS EVERY TIME.”
However, generally, it’s going right into a room and never doing any of that stuff – it’s nearly managing the state of affairs and attempting to get individuals in a way of thinking the place they really feel snug sufficient to provide you with concepts in entrance of one another.
I used to get fairly freaked out if there was rigidity, like, it’s all going to disintegrate. However now, I discover that actually fascinating. I really like the dynamics between completely different individuals and attempting to navigate that. For those who go in open, sincere and never attempting to be too Machiavellian about it, attempting to assist individuals get one of the best out of themselves, you’ll be able to’t go too far mistaken.
YOU’VE HAD A COUPLE OF INTERESTING EXPERIENCES IN THAT AREA IN RECENT YEARS…
Yeah, Depeche Mode’s Spirit was an actual baptism of fireside. It was at a degree the place their interpersonal relationships had been fairly strained, to say the least.
There was simply this rigidity with Martin [Gore] and Dave [Gahan] that you may minimize with a knife and poor Fletch [Andy Fletcher], bless him, acquired caught within the center.
It acquired to some extent the place Martin was going to go away the band. I acquired a telephone name at 3am from the administration, ‘Are you able to cancel the session tomorrow, we’ve acquired an issue’. We ended up on this massive empty studio, everybody had been despatched residence and it was like a wedding steerage counselling session with me, the managers and Martin and Dave speaking to one another. Ultimately, they patched it up and we acquired by way of the report, however it was anxious.
AND YET YOU WENT BACK FOR MORE?
We left on fairly bizarre phrases, there have been a number of arguments and stuff, so I used to be fairly stunned once they requested me again to do one other report [2023’s Memento Mori]. I agreed to go round yet another time, however I used to be barely apprehensive.
Then, actually sadly, a number of weeks earlier than we had been resulting from begin, poor Andy handed away. It turned out they needed to hold on and, weirdly, due to that, the entire thing completely flipped on its head.
A brush with mortality meant that Martin and Dave had been truly talking to one another immediately for the primary time in years and reconnecting. It was a very pretty, simple report to make, and it got here out nice due to that. It was a really odd, touching expertise.
Picture credit score: Reuben Bastienne-Lewis
AND THEN YOU DID BLUR’S REUNION ALBUM?
I used to be at all times Blur over Oasis. I at all times revered their writing and preferred their melodic selections. I’d labored with Graham and Damon individually and acquired on with them each, however I do know the historical past: Graham left the band and the previous couple of information have been a bit fraught, so I used to be like, ‘We might be in for a bumpy trip’. However you’ll be able to’t flip down the chance to be in that state of affairs.
“I WAS ALWAYS BLUR OVER OASIS. I RESPECTED THEIR WRITING AND LOVED THEIR MELODIC CHOICES.”
We had some conferences earlier than we began they usually had been actually tense, you may see numerous the previous dangerous blood between them; they hadn’t actually been in a room collectively for 10 years. It had the potential to spiral and the primary few days had been fairly intense, however I took the technique of attempting to plough ahead as shortly as potential.
It solely took a day or two for all of it to start out clicking into place. The vitality was all of a sudden actually excessive; it was nearly getting by way of that first bit, and after that, it went actually easily. By the second week they had been all laughing and joking, taking the piss out of one another and reminiscing over bizarre previous tales. I used to be loving it, I used to be like a fly on the wall.
DO YOU, LIKE MANY OTHER PRODUCERS, BEAR TIKTOK IN MIND WHEN YOU’RE PRODUCING?
I’ve by no means thought of it, no. I don’t even know if the 20-second TikTok [clip] feeds into individuals listening to the music correctly.
I undoubtedly don’t cater for the TikTok world, generally issues get on there that I’ve labored on, however it’s not by any design of mine. It looks as if bending to the desire of the buyer an excessive amount of, there’s one thing a bit icky about it that I discover disingenuous. I simply don’t suppose it makes for good artwork.
SO HOW DO YOU FEEL ABOUT THE POTENTIAL THREAT FROM AI?
Music goes to be so simply generated sooner or later. The one factor that’s going to carry its worth would be the high tier of nice artwork, individuals making nice stuff that’s human. I can’t consider you’re going to have an AI Leonard Cohen. Possibly that’s me being an previous man, possibly a brand new technology received’t care, however that human-to-human connection is what drives most individuals to devour any artwork or music.
My means of manufacturing could be very hands-on, bodily, about actual issues. There are such a lot of micro-decisions for higher and for worse within the making of music and music manufacturing. You would possibly get a facsimile of one thing somebody’s already accomplished, however I defy it to do the identical as I’d do in the second.
HOW DO YOU FEEL ABOUT THE TREND FOR HAVING MULTIPLE CO-WRITERS AND CO-PRODUCERS ON A TRACK?
I’ve been by way of these conditions and, even simply doing one or two tracks on a report, if it’s going to be like that, I’m not that . I would like the entire report to carry collectively and, if you happen to’ve acquired completely different individuals pulling in numerous instructions, I try to keep away.
All one of the best information, and one of the best songs even, are one individual’s imaginative and prescient – ideally the individual singing the tune – and also you’ve acquired a collaborator or some facilitators who assist that one, guiding imaginative and prescient go ahead. If you’ve acquired a great deal of individuals pulling in numerous instructions, you get this bizarre, gray, center bland factor, simply by the character of it.
Loads of these writing rooms are simply individuals attempting to get their chords into the middle-eight. It’s about who’s one of the best salesman in that second and who’s acquired the loudest voice. The entire thing simply appears a bit advertising [oriented] and that comes throughout within the music. These committee writing camps lead nowhere good.
IF YOU COULD CHANGE ONE THING ABOUT THE MUSIC INDUSTRY, RIGHT HERE AND NOW, WHAT WOULD IT BE AND WHY?
I’d discover a means of getting artists paid extra. I’m conscious streaming would possibly work if it was going on to the artist, however it’s this old fashioned music business mannequin the place most of it’s nonetheless going to the labels.
We’re going to attain a degree, if we’re not cautious – and we’re in all probability already there – the place the standard of music goes down, as a result of new artists can’t survive. It’s virtually impossibly costly to be in a band at this level in historical past and the place’s that going to go away us in 10 years? We have to discover a higher system to get artists, particularly younger artists, paid.
DOES THAT APPLY TO PRODUCERS AS WELL?
It applies to all people. I’m not complaining, however I’m in a really lucky place. There are lots of people struggling to make ends meet.
It additionally forces individuals to make music based mostly on business choices. Folks hark again to the glory days, however there was way more room for manoeuvre when there was extra artist-facing cash within the music business. Now, some tech billionaires are making billions and the individuals truly making the music aren’t getting paid. We’re making a bizarre two-tier system.Music Enterprise Worldwide
